AWLGRIP Polish / Painting project

[DPTrainor]

I have a 2x3 ft section on hull of my AWLGRIP'ed boat that has very very fine scraches on top surface of paint - fine enough you can just feel them with your hand and see them if you look very very closely - but the main symptom is the area is visibily dull - as compared to gloss of rest of hull. (The orginal AWGRIP painting was done probably 8+ years ago and has still has good gloss with probably a slight fading in color)

So, Plan A is to first attempt to polish away the dullness -without removing too much paint - possibly (with luck) bringing back gloss to reasonable level, before going to plan B which is to sand, clean, prime 545, sand, clean, repaint, polish (per standard AWLGRIP schedule) - attempting to get a decent color match/blend with surrounding paint.

So wrt to Plan A: "polishing", on 3M site I have found several compounds/glazes and I am not sure how aggressive to go. Here is what they have:

Compounds:

http://products3.3m.com/catalog/us/en00 ... utput_html

Glazes:

http://products3.3m.com/catalog/us/en00 ... utput_html

I also found this sanding schedule from a post on Jamestown site:

"...
360 Titan 2
1000 Platin 2 (special soft foam pad)
2000 Platin 2
3M Finesse It with Clean wool bonnet on rotary polisher
...
The Platin takes the haze from the other grits and leaves you with a near mirror surface, The Porter Cable buffer with Finesse gives that mirror finish."

So, some choices here. Any advise as to what I might try first? What do folks think is a reasonable approach to start?

My AWLGRIP experience is limited to annual spring touch-up of very small dings/scratches with artist brush which have always come out very nice.

I'll post a close-up picture as soon as I can get back down to boat.

Best Regards,

[Mark.Wilme]

Dan,

I took a swing by your boat when I left on Saturday. I am no expert but I don't think you'll be able to polish it out plus our experience with Awlgrip on our previous boat is that you have to be careful what products you use with it. We had marginal success with Y10 and then the Awlcare range of products - but we had nothing as sever as what you have to deal with.

I can take a photo of it next weekend when I am down there and share with the group if you like ? I know you wont be doing any respraying for a while yet because you need 65 degrees and the boat is outside.

[DPTrainor]

Hey Mark,

Thanks - sorry I missed you when you stopped by the boat. Wrt awlgrp project, is it possible that you saw the "other" damaged area on my hull? The one where the scrape when right through to the white gelocat? Thats another project - a 6 by 8" in area that definitely needs to be repainted in the spring - its on the list. The area of question in my post has a hazy-ness / dullness due to very fine scratches/swirls - that area is located forward of damaged area. I am hoping I can buff this area out to gloss. I am not sure why that is not possible yet, but that is the nature of my question. Maybe it is not possible. I think a high-res picture is required to get best advise.

Yes, if you don't mind, it would be great to have picture - thank you - I won't be able to make it down next weekend.

Let me know if there is anything I can do for you.

Thanks,

Dan

[Mark.Wilme]

It could have been the other area. Hmmm

I'll take photos on Monday (15th).

Are you going to the Providence boat show this weekend ?

Anyone going ?

[DPTrainor]

Thanks Mark,

No, I am staying up North this weekend. Have fun at the show.

Dan

[Tim]

Awlgrip isn't a great product for successful repairs through buffing, particularly as the coating ages. Whatever you do, don't treat it like gelcoat. Not only will you not have success, but you'll probably shorten the remaining life of your Awlgrip. Typical waxes and polishes will no only not help much in the long term, but will also make it that much more difficult to eventually repaint your boat when the time comes.

Awlgrip is happiest being simply washed, and perhaps being cleaned and polished with Awl-Care.

That said, the most general advice possible is to use the least aggressive materials and techniques that do the job. It would be quite easy to make a mistake that would worsen, rather than make better, the areas in question.

Are these areas something that's visible when the boat's in the water, or just when you look at her on the hard? Most boats look pretty awful when the hull is right at eye level, but those horrible problems just disappear when the boat's in the water. My hull doesn't look like I wish it did when I stare at the boat on the ground, but once she's in the water again, I don't even notice the problems.

[DPTrainor]

Thanks Tim. No, the hazed area can be seen from about 20ft when boat is on water, especially if sun shines on hull. It is not bad, it is just a contrast to surrounding glossy paint. I hope to maintain 10ft test.

To date, I have only washed boat with water (carefully) and once a year in the spring clean with AWLWASH soap and water twice followed by a light cleaning and polishing with AWLCARE (which has no abrasives) by hand.

This hazed/dull area was the result of light sand blowing off a beach and getting behind my fenders which have fleece covers. Some light abrasion occured. The result was very fine sanding scratches and therfore a dulling of paint.

My thinking was that when folks re-paint thier topsides, they sand/smooth out brush marks with finer and finer grit paper/compond going to 1000 - 1500/2000 grit and then polish to mirror finish with the least abrasive polish - or atleast that was my understanding reading another post. But maybe I read false info. (I will have to review AWLGRIP application instructions again) -or- maybe this type of sanding / polishing schedule only works on a refreshly painted boat?

My paint is 8+ years old, this this method of bringing gloss back may actually make it worse? Hard to know without trying it. I suspose I will simply try least agressive polishing glaze and see if I can remove the haze. Worse case, I repaint.

Question: To save some work, would it be acceptable to clean this area with T0008 solvent cleaner, lightly sand with 400-600 grit to rough up, clean gain, then brush on new paint? Or probably will this not adhere to old paint?

Plan B is to bring it all the way down to gelcoat and go though entire process: sand down to gelcoat, clean, prime 545, sand fair, clean, prime again and sand smooth, apply two coats of new paint, blending with surrounding old paint. I have done this with very small areas (basically smaller touch-ups) with but this one is a 2 x 3 ft? section and it might not match with rest of topsides.

I also have a 6 x 8" section that was scrapped down to white gelocat - I definitely can prep and repaint that area and I am convinced it will come out good. A larger area - I am not so confident with as I have not done it before.

If I can pass the 10 ft test in both these areas, I am more than happy.

Any additional thoughts would be appretiated, as I re-read the AWLGRIP painting specs.

Best Regards,

[Tim]

The biggest difficulty you will have patching and repairing Awlgrip is getting the new area to blend with the old. While a methodical buffing process can work pretty well on new Awlgrip, it tends to be less effective as the paint gets older. Actually once the coating passes beyond its "stage 3" cure after application, the surface becomes so hard that it is very difficult to buff out and blend. I know that I don't have the buffing skills to try it myself.

It's not common practice to "color sand" new Awlgrip after application, at least as a general rule. The properties of the paint itself are such that when properly applied, it is entirely self-leveling and doesn't need smoothing. This doesn't mean that sanding and buffing of newly painted boats doesn't occur. It does, but it's not considered part of the normal application process by any means.

It is possible to smooth imperfections in a newly painted surface by fine sanding and compounding, and if done correctly the results should be good. For blending new paint into old, though, I think you'd have to sand and compound the transitional area, and probably the entire newly painted area, to attempt to match. I'm not an expert by any means on paint buffing and blending.

If you've had good results on the smaller areas, I see no reason why following the same process that you used before wouldn't work for you on a larger area. All you can do is try. There are no guarantees, of course!

Good luck.