"I THINK" I am ready to start the painting process

[amerigo]

Well I hauled my 50' mast 40 miles to a shop where I can begin the painting process.

I think I have the process down but wanted to run it by you guys to see if I really do.

Sandblast Mast.

Use Alumiprep and Alodine as instructed.

I have no fairing or filling to do so i can prime the mast with 30-Y-94 or
gray primer 545, can i use the white primer since the top coat will be snow white?

Put on at least 2 coats of primer.

Put on at least 3 coats of top coat.

Is that it?

Sorry for these basic questions, this is my first attempt at painting anything significant.

[Invitation]

My only recommendation is to paint with the Interlux Perfection. I used this for the first time about a month ago and it is a huge improvment over the Interlux Interthane paint which I have used for years. Your working time is at least twice as long, you don't have to thin it as much and it really flows out like glass, and I mean glass. You will easily end up with a sprayed finish.

Of course you can ignore all of this if your having it sprayed.

Good Luck.

[Tim]

Since you're planning on sandblasting the mast to clean metal and using the chemical treatments, I would use the 30-Y-94 primer after the Alodine step. This is an anticorrosive primer designed for use on bare aluminum when also using the chemical etching treatments.

Once the 30-Y-94 primer is installed, you can go directly to topcoats; or, if you prefer, you can apply the 545 primer over the top. If you use 545, the white version would be a good choice beneath your white topcoat. The 30-Y-94 primer has to be covered the same day it is applied; you can use either the 545 primer or the topcoats. I don't really know why one would bother with the 545 primer in this particular process; the beauty of tgoing with topcoats is that you can be done with the whole prepping and painting process in a single day.

Check out the Awlgrip application guide at www.awlgrip.com, if you haven't already. It gives more details on the basic process outlined here. The other two methods outlined in the guide make more use of the 545 primers.

[amerigo]

Oh, well if I can go directly to topcoats after the 30-Y-94 Ill do that for sure. Thanks for the great tips.

[George ( C&C 40 )]

Hi Amerigo,


If you use the 545 primer on aluminum I would use the gray. That, at least, is what was specified in the original application guide. It actually said to ONLY use the gray 545 primer on aluminum if you were rolling and tipping the job after Alumiprep and Aldoine 1201-- do not use the white.

The new application guide, however, is a little vague on the point, so I'm not sure what the current thinking on the subject is. The new application guide only mentions 30-Y-94 primer after the Alumiprep and Aldoine 1201 on aluminum that does not require any fairing. Does not mention 545 primer at all under the System III aluminum specifications. Why the change, I do not know.

At this point I have done three roll and tip masts in Awlgrip Snow White. A Triton, a C&C 40, and a large Cat-Boat. I'm just about to lay down the topcoats on my Wavelength 24 mast too -- mast #4. I used 545 gray primer on all and all came out perfectly. They still look brand new even a few years later.

Remember, thin thin thin -- and then thin again,

George Jones

[amerigo]

Thanks George, I plan on spraying the mast I have more expierience with a gun, I have never done this roll and tip process. Tim says I do not need to use a primer if I am sandblasting the mast down to bare metal, just alumiprep and alodine then on to top coats. Sounds good to me. Good luck with your 4th mast!

[amerigo]

Oh yeah the 30-Y-94 is a primer. but after that onto topcoats!

[Tim]

One difference between George's and my methods is that George has been rolling and tipping his spars. The 30-Y-94 primer is not brushable, so it is applicable only to spray jobs. For brushing, one would have to go with the 545 primer route, as did George.

Amerigo, since you're spraying, you're good to go with the 30-Y-94, and you can have the whole mast DONE in a single day--a very nice attribute of this particular process.

[amerigo]

Thanks, Tim. Great comments. I like the idea of a one day process.

[amerigo]

You guys probably have a better idea than I do on how much of each product I will need to do this mast. Do I need quarts or gallons of Alumiprep and alodine? How about the primer and topcoat? Any educated quess would be appreciated. Thanks

[Tim]

Quarts of Alumiprep and Alodine represent lifetime supplies. The process uses VERY little product. Get the smallest containers you can. I bought a gallon of Alodine, and will have that for the rest of my life no matter how many masts I ever paint!

A quart kit of the chromate primer will certainly be more than enough; a quart of topcoat will also be plenty for most spars.

[Harry James]

I have to ask, you are using a full mask with supplied air if you are spraying Awlgrip right?

[amerigo]

Well actually I wasnt going to use supplied air. Guess maybe I should re-think this? Maybe I should of just paid the $3,000 the yard wanted to paint this mast and boom.

[Jason K]

That stuff can be literally lethal. I wouldn't pay $3000 to have a yard do the job, but I would take every precaution to protect myself. Do it wrong and you may be sailing on the Black Pearl.

[amerigo]

If I wait until spring and take the mast outside the building do I still need the full mask and air supply. Maybe I should use this roll and tip process I keep reading about. Is that why the Y-30-94 primer says for professional use only?

[Tim]

There are some people who, when asked, would downplay the dangers of spraying Awlgrip and the need for supplied air, usually with some argument along the lines of: "Well, if you did it every day, yeah, you should, but if you're just doing it once, all you need is a respirator".

Everyone needs to decide for themselves what sort of safety precautions need to be taken, whatever the job. It's not anyone's place to tell you what you should or should not do. That said, I strongly suggest that you use a supplied air system if spraying Awlgrip or similar product indoors.

Outdoors, the need for supplied air is perhaps debatable, though without a doubt it is always best to use supplied air. I used supplied air when spraying my mast outdoors, but then I had previously obtained the supplied air system for other projects. But at least outdoors, the product can disperse more quickly, and prevent the concentration of fumes that could be harmful.

Yes, Awlgrip products are labeled as "professional" use largely because of their toxicity. Frankly, you don't even want to open and mix the paint without a respirator. The fumes are powerful, and at the very least make you feel heady. If you don't atomize the products (through spraying), they are safe to use with a quality organic vapor respirator (not a dust mask, but a real respirator).

A lot of people do dumb things. Maybe spraying Awlgrip without supplied air is one of them, or perhaps not. I, for one, don't want to be the one to find out!

For what it's worth, now that I have the supplied air system, I routinely use it for nearly all sanding and grinding chores. It sure beats a respirator! The point is that the purchase is not frivolous if you do this sort of work regularly.

Check out this posting from earlier this year. It describes a sort of home-built fresh air breathing apparatus used for paint spraying. I point you towards this for informational purposes only.

[Summersdawn]

Check out local tool rental places. I know where I live you can rent a supplied air rig. It sounds like you can do the painting in one day, so you would only have to rent it for one day - price shouldn't be too bad.

[bcooke]

A lot of people do dumb things. Maybe spraying Awlgrip without supplied air is one of them, or perhaps not. I, for one, don't want to be the one to find out!

My own two cents suggests that different people have different tolerances or reactions to the stuff. I know a guy that has been spraying Imron (like Awl Grip I believe) inside with no respirator for years, quite often and on big projects (large construction equipment)and gets nothing but a beet red face for the experience.

I also know my grandfather was attached to an oxygen tank for the last fifteen years of his life as his lungs slowly decayed from a couple of years of painting with an Awl Grip like paint in the automotive industry.

Maybe you will get away with it and maybe it won't. The question in my mind is whether the results are worth the risk.

-Britton

[bcooke]

I should add that watching my grandfather's lungs turn to mush was a pretty horrific experience. That is definitely not the way I want to go.

[George ( C&C 40 )]

Hi All,

Remember, you don't have to spray this stuff. If you don't mind spreading the project out over a few days you can just roll and tip it.

George Jones

[amerigo]

Thank you all for the information. I am so glad I joined this forum. I have a feeling that my son and I would of just gone ahead and sprayed that mast indoors with just a mask on.

Now I know why when the guy at the boat yard told me $3,000 to paint the mast and boom, and I said I will do it myself, he gave me this weird look and said "Good luck with that"

Thanks Again.

[Tim]

Now I know why when the guy at the boat yard told me $3,000 to paint the mast and boom, and I said I will do it myself, he gave me this weird look and said "Good luck with that"

All the more reason to do a great job yourself. Arrogant boatyard people drive me up a tree. They feel they're so...indespensible. Well guess what: they're not. And there's no better way to prove it than to work on your boat yourself and see that, much to your boatyard guy's chagrin, you need not belong to a secret society to do well.

So then, seriously: good luck with the painting! You'll do great. Remember: a quality coating relies entirely upon properly reducing the paint for the conditions and application, and applying the correct amount of product.