Cold beer

[Figment]

Here's a guy who got sick of hauling ice, and installed a 12v refrigeration system in his icebox. He has an 8D "house" battery, and this battery has enough capacity to keep his beer cold for about 3 days. His problem is that he likes to go for a week at a time, and hates running his engine at anchor just to charge up. He just installed a new 3GM30 at some great expense, and is afraid of harming it by running under light load for extended time.

What to do? It's really all about the beer, I swear to god.

[dasein668]

Where's he cruising? 'Round here you can just hang the bottle over the side and it'll be quite refreshing in about 20 minutes.

[Tim]

"Secret" Option E:

The correct answer is a combination of some of the above choices. Additional battery capacity is the first thing. I would scrap the 8D and go with several sets of 6 volt golf cart batteries--as many as can fit, or as many as needed. Each pair produces a potential 220 amp-hours, or about the same as an 8D. They are easier to handle, and less expensive overall. There are few cheaper sources of excellent cruising-boat power. That said, continuing with 8Ds is fine also. It depends on the space available, and how the batteries are treated. I'd rather lug 6 volters around; 8Ds are nearly impossible to move, ever.

His engine has plenty of power to spin a large-frame alternator, say up to 100-120 amps. The larger alternator will help reduce charging time, but not by as much as one might think. Perhaps more benefit comes from the then-required smart external regulator (many of which are all set up for solar and wind connections too), which provides a more efficient charge when all is said and done. If he adds batteries to his load, then upgrading the alternator will become almost a necessity in order to charge them properly, and efficiently--especially if he tends to run them well down each time.

Solar panels are fine, and certainly help. The problem is they are expensive, the larger ones require regulation, and they take up a lot of room that he may or may not have available. When there are significant demands on the DC system, such as from a refer system, it would take too much expensive panel area to make much of a difference. I'd rather install extra batteries first. Given the cost vs. productivity factor, and the large amount of area required, solar panels go low on my list in this application. Again, it depends too much on the individual situation to discount them out of hand, but as a down and dirty solution, it's probably not the right choice.

Running the engine to charge batteries is a fact of life once you start adding bells and whistles--especially refers. Asking to go a full week at anchor without needing to charge the batteries is a tall order. 3 days is pretty durn good. People need to get over the over-emphasized worries about running their engines under less load. One smart and effective way to avoid this is to run the engine in reverse gear instead of in neutral. Running in gear puts the requisite load on the engine that is lacking when simply running them in neutral. And it keeps you pulling nicely on your anchor line. Note that if you drag doing this, obviously you're saving headache because you would have dragged the first second any wind came up anyway. A properly-set (and -sized) anchor simply will not drag because the boat is put in reverse--wind puts far more strain on the setup. (Just anticipating a typical question and misconception.)

The only way to ensure enough battery capacity for your wants and needs is to accurately figure daily consumption, then multiply it by the number of days desired between charging. This gives the minimum amp-hour capacity required. Now multiply that figure by 2 (since at best, batteries have about 50% effective capacity) to determine the total battery capacity required.

Here's what I would do (and basically did do, though I have no refer and therefore require far less battery capacity):

1. Install large-frame, high-capacity alternator, ensuring that it is properly sized for the engine. Probably 110-ish amps. These things draw several horsepower off any engine, so the overall appropriateness of the engine for the boat must also be taken into account.

2. Install external regulator with alternator, which will allow more efficient charging. Most alternator upgrades require this anyway, as few, if any, are internally regulated. Also important is some sort of accurate battery monitor, so that the true condition of the batteries can be determined at any time. This also helps with scheduling efficient and effective charging sessions, should they ever be necessary. If this guy likes fancy stuff, has the budget, and likes a project (or likes paying others), the Ample Power system E/Next (which I have) is a great way to go.

3. Install additional battery capacity as required to provide ample power for the time and draw desired. If it's important enough, then this step is a no-brainer. He needs to triple his effective capacity, at least.

4. Run engine in reverse at anchor, should interim charging ever become necessary.

5. Raise waterline to account for all the additional weight in batteries, alternators, and cases of beer.

[Dave, 397]

Or...

Store Beer in Bilge.

It will be cool enough on a hot day to seem frosty cold. This is especially true if it is cheap beer in cans, which will not only seem to be awfully cold but perhaps the very best beer he ever drank.

"Hey, this stuff with the ducks on the can is pretty good!"

-----------------or-----------------

"It really IS the King of Beers!"

---------------or----------------

"I know it sounds bad, but they aren't kidding about the Champagne of Beers thing!"


--------Which leads to---------

"Why don't we ever drink this at home?!?"


-------Resulting In------------

"Good God! This stuff is BAD! But it tasted so good on the boat!"

------Because-----------------

Everything's better on the boat. Lukewarm cheap beer in cans, Store-brand gutrot cola, even SPAM or wine with a screwtop. Especially fried SPAM served with wine with a screwtop.

-----Proving------------------

That the fellow is simply not having to work hard enough at getting into the ancorage to begin with, and robbing himself of the chance to enjoy the finer things in life. We are only enabling his self-destructive behavior!

Dave

[Figment]

Cruising waters... Long Island Sound, occasionally as far as Buzzard's Bay. But John generally picks shallow anchorages like the Great Salt Pond at Block Island, or Hamburg Cove, where the water is bathtub warm by late July.

"8D's are nearly impossible to move".... That's actually how the topic surfaced in the first place. I spent most of Sunday morning wrestling two dead (overboiled) 8Ds out of my dad's engine room, and wrestling THREE new ones back in. Then down the dock to replace the 8D in Beer Guy's boat. (Hey, when you're built like a human forklift, and the youngest guy on the dock by 25 years....) That much heavy lifting tends to draw a crowd, and sooner or later someone's memory jogged; "hey, wasn't that a new battery last JULY?!? how'd you kill it so fast??"

A house bank of 6volt golfcart units is my favored solution.
The boat lives at a dock, not on a mooring, so when he leaves for a trip the fridge and contents are already at temperature, and the batteries are at max charge via shorepower tricklecharging. Go for the week, let the fridge run the house batteries dead as a doornail, fire up the engine with its dedicated group24 battery, and let the house bank trickle trickle trickle full again via shorepower all week long. The boat is a Seafarer 30. In my estimation, it can take the ballast. Others on the dock (Hunters and Beneteaus, grrrr) had other suggestions.

Also, I personally think that it wouldn't be the end of the world if he had to buy a few blocks of ice to get through the last two days of a weeklong trip, but I recognize that this defeats the purpose of the question. I figure my opinion gets DQ'd automatically because I don't plan to use anything beyond my goofy igloo cube cooler for the forseeable future. It just fits SO perfectly between the setees!!

[Tim]

This guy sounds like a battery's worst nightmare. His problem is that he's running the batteries down too far. Nothing kills them faster. They should never be discharged below 50%, ever (including during storage). It really shortens their life, as witnessed by the need for a new 8D after only a few short months of use.

But then, some people seem to enjoy buying batteries. To each their own! Probably more batteries get unnecessarily replaced (i.e. general maintenance and care would have avoided it) by negligent boatowners each year than any other thing. It doesn't help that most boats have hopelessly inadequate electrical/charging setups from the getgo.

[dasein668]

But then, some people seem to enjoy buying batteries. To each their own!

And of course, batteries are right up there with the nastiest waste boaters produce, so of course, we should try to create as many waste batteries as possible! ::rolleyes::

As far as discharging them goes, not only is it bad to discharge past 50%, but (especially when using "normal" charging regimes) your average house battery only gets charged to about 85% or so of maximum charge, due to how much the acceptance rate drops for the last few percent of the battery's capacity. So this should be taken into account when calculating necessary battery capacity.

Sounds like that probably isn't an issue for Beer Guy though, since he plugs in and trickles all week...